[Joe Kerr]

I think you have taken this discussion in the wrong direction. We are not talking about racism. We are talking about a religion not a race.

If you knew someone hated you and wanted to kill you you would stay away from them. If you knew that your family had caused someone harm and they blamed you, you would stay away from them. Hundreds of years ago if someones family got mad at the other one the whole family was at fault not the one person. This is how we still think no matter how we try to say we don't. If i knew that building a christian church on a Muslim burial ground would cause them emotional stress i wouldn't do it. The thing is they don't return the favor.

[Eric]

It is partially about race, because mainly the ones being profiled are Arabs. Sure, there are many different kinds of Muslims, but they draw the most fire. Really though, I mean religious discrimination, but I do tend to misapply the term racism to represent any form of prejudice. It's just easier, and it's one of those shock words that gets people's attention.

This is how we still think no matter how we try to say we don't.

But we should recognize that we do think this way, and overcome it. We should be able to recognize this flaw in ourselves, and actively work to not think this way.

If i knew that building a christian church on a Muslim burial ground would cause them emotional stress i wouldn't do it. The thing is they don't return the favor.

There are Muslim dead at ground zero as well, again, not just terrorists. Why shouldn't they be allowed to honor the dead that they have there? It's not as though everyone who died was Christian. It's not an us vs. them, and we need to stop thinking that way. It's just "Us."

The whole reason this issue is arising is because of a deep lack of religious understanding, and to some degree intolerance. When Obama was running for president, the whole "Obama is a Muslim" slur campaign came out. First off, why was that considered a slur campaign? Is it bad for the President of the US to be a Muslim? Why? The Obama campaign responded with, "No, he's not." But what they really should have responded with was "So what if he is?"

[Joe Kerr]

Aug 15, 2010 22:17:26 GMT Eric said:

It is partially about race, because mainly the ones being profiled are Arabs. Sure, there are many different kinds of Muslims, but they draw the most fire. Really though, I mean religious discrimination, but I do tend to misapply the term racism to represent any form of prejudice. It's just easier, and it's one of those shock words that gets people's attention.

This is how we still think no matter how we try to say we don't.

But we should recognize that we do think this way, and overcome it. We should be able to recognize this flaw in ourselves, and actively work to not think this way.

If i knew that building a christian church on a Muslim burial ground would cause them emotional stress i wouldn't do it. The thing is they don't return the favor.

There are Muslim dead at ground zero as well, again, not just terrorists. Why shouldn't they be allowed to honor the dead that they have there? It's not as though everyone who died was Christian. It's not an us vs. them, and we need to stop thinking that way. It's just "Us."

The whole reason this issue is arising is because of a deep lack of religious understanding, and to some degree intolerance. When Obama was running for president, the whole "Obama is a Muslim" slur campaign came out. First off, why was that considered a slur campaign? Is it bad for the President of the US to be a Muslim? Why? The Obama campaign responded with, "No, he's not." But what they really should have responded with was "So what if he is?"

If a Muslim leader came out and said, "We are building this Mosque because we know how some people in our religion made a terrible mistake and we would like to honer the people they killed" i would be fine with it but they did the opposite when they named it after a mosque they built when they started conquering Spain (i think it was)

The problem with a Muslim president is it wouldn't be good for our country at this point. I know this isn't rite but alot of people still think that all Muslims are trying to kill us. We know it isn't ALL Muslims but it is true that we are fighting a war against some of them and they are trying to kill us. It just wouldn't be the rite thing for this country NOW for a Muslim president to be elected. It would throw the country into chaos even though it would be wrong. I do not approve of Obama but i do know that if something happened to him it would be bad for the country and if the country doesn't trust most Muslims than the country will have no respect for a Muslim president. It is dangerouse when people do not have respect for the leader of a country. Only bad things can happen.

[Jim]

I cannot fathom being so ignorant and being so much of a bigot as to actually care or think that it is a bad idea to build a mosque NEAR ground zero. Seriously, open your mind and eyes.

The whole idea behind the World Trade Center was to provide a complex for world trade, which means dealing with people from religions all over the world. Every major religion should have some sort of building or structure in the area. Every religion should be able to honor those dead, whether those dead were of their own religion or not.

[Eric]

Read this:
www.nytimes.com/2009/12/09/nyregion/09mosque.html?_r=1

At the start of this planning, before any of this really got to be an issue, they wanted it to be a message against the attacks on 9/11.

As far as the reason for the name:
"The Cordoba House was supposed to be a monument to religious tolerance, an homage to the city in Spain where Muslims, Jews, and Christians lived together centuries ago in the midst of religious foment."
www.nytimes.com/2010/07/14/nyregion/14center.html

In your response to the president part, you said because other people don't trust Muslims. That's what I'm saying needs to be fixed. We need something to bridge this gap that doesn't seem to be closing.

[Joe Kerr]

Aug 15, 2010 23:03:42 GMT Eric said:

Read this:
www.nytimes.com/2009/12/09/nyregion/09mosque.html?_r=1

At the start of this planning, before any of this really got to be an issue, they wanted it to be a message against the attacks on 9/11.

As far as the reason for the name:
"The Cordoba House was supposed to be a monument to religious tolerance, an homage to the city in Spain where Muslims, Jews, and Christians lived together centuries ago in the midst of religious foment."
www.nytimes.com/2010/07/14/nyregion/14center.html

In your response to the president part, you said because other people don't trust Muslims. That's what I'm saying needs to be fixed. We need something to bridge this gap that doesn't seem to be closing.

I don't think this is the way to bridge that gap...the rite way to do this would be for them to come out and say that they were sorry about what had happened at that place, how they did not support it, and how they are going to try to stop the problems in their religion.

[Jim]

Aug 15, 2010 23:25:15 GMT Joe Kerr said:

Aug 15, 2010 23:03:42 GMT Eric said:

Read this:
www.nytimes.com/2009/12/09/nyregion/09mosque.html?_r=1

At the start of this planning, before any of this really got to be an issue, they wanted it to be a message against the attacks on 9/11.

As far as the reason for the name:
"The Cordoba House was supposed to be a monument to religious tolerance, an homage to the city in Spain where Muslims, Jews, and Christians lived together centuries ago in the midst of religious foment."
www.nytimes.com/2010/07/14/nyregion/14center.html

In your response to the president part, you said because other people don't trust Muslims. That's what I'm saying needs to be fixed. We need something to bridge this gap that doesn't seem to be closing.

I don't think this is the way to bridge that gap...the rite way to do this would be for them to come out and say that they were sorry about what had happened at that place, how they did not support it, and how they are going to try to stop the problems in their religion.

You think they should apologize for something they had no part in? Something that is not in their control? There's no reason at all for them to apologize. There are no problems in the religion, there are problems with a very select few in the religion. It is not in their power to control everyone.

[Joe Kerr]

No i do not think they should apologize they did nothing wrong. But they should do something to stop the problem. I am Catholic, some things have happened in the name of Catholicism and the first thing that happens is the Pope comes out and says, "We are sorry for what happened. These people were not following the teachings of our church. This problem is going to be fixed."

That is not to hard to do.

[perishingflames]

Just came to post here to thank everyone for the great humor (specifically, Nightwalker and Fredy). But it saddens me to think they represent the large majority of America and people like them actually are making this whole thing an issue. I mean seriously, it's not even on Ground Zero (you wouldn't be able to see it from Ground Zero), and it's mission is "to bridge the divide between American Muslims and their non-Muslim compatriots and to foster cross-cultural understanding." And anyone who thinks that the government should prevent them from building the mosque there is not only a bigot but an idiot. Ever heard of freedom of religion? Probably not (looking at Nightwalker) considering you are most likely about 11 years old, just by looking at your grammar (Tip: It is spelled "allowed" not "aloud"). The real issue is whether it is disrespectful, considering that we are led to believe that Muslims (...Jihadists) destroyed the towers. Regardless of whether this is true or not, why should all the other Muslims take the blame? It is because most conservative, right-wing Americans are prejudiced against Muslims in the first place.

Oh and the whole discussion about whether Muslims/Jews/Christians believe in the same god literally had me rolling on the floor laughing. Fredy, I almost feel bad for you, you have been brainwashed by not only people who are devout Christians, but retarded devout Christians.

Ok so parting words: Chris, you should probably ban the Nightwalker kid. He is clearly under 13. It would be unfortunate if proboards stumbled across this forum and saw an underage member posting.

[Eric]

Aug 16, 2010 0:06:03 GMT Joe Kerr said:

No i do not think they should apologize they did nothing wrong. But they should do something to stop the problem. I am Catholic, some things have happened in the name of Catholicism and the first thing that happens is the Pope comes out and says, "We are sorry for what happened. These people were not following the teachings of our church. This problem is going to be fixed."

That is not to hard to do.

Last I checked, the Pope tried to brush cases of child molestation under the rug. However, that is Catholicism, and Islam has no pope-like figure. There is no organized Islamic police that can really do any more than they are already doing to stop the extremists.

@perishing: Perhaps fewer personal jabs and just a statement of your opinion.


Last Edit: Aug 16, 2010 0:18:17 GMT by Eric

[Josh]

This thread has gone on for far long enough. It's gotten out of hand, really. I'm gonna end it here.